Quote from wildgoosespeeder on June 26, 2014, 8:39 pm

quaternary wrote:

There needs to be an honest trailer for Portal 2 PTI maps.

"Knock over 25 turrets for no reason, put the cube on the button, spend thirty minutes walking alllll the way across the map to get to the exit, and pretend you had fun doing that!"

I had a long conversation with someone and we came up with many types of maps that get shat out to the workshop:

Code: Select all

2:40 AM - wildgoosespeeder: should there be a guide how *not* to create chambers?
2:40 AM - p0rtalmaster: It's tempting to create one, however...
2:40 AM - p0rtalmaster: People naturally don't like to be told what not to do.
2:40 AM - p0rtalmaster: It's discouraging.
2:41 AM - wildgoosespeeder: the point
2:41 AM - wildgoosespeeder: that is the point
2:41 AM - wildgoosespeeder: we want to discourage shit
2:41 AM - p0rtalmaster: And so I save it for the comments.
2:41 AM - p0rtalmaster: I let the guide do most of the positive talking.
2:42 AM - wildgoosespeeder: which clearly most people don't do
2:42 AM - wildgoosespeeder: "positive", "thinking", or "positive thinking"
2:42 AM - p0rtalmaster: Good question.......
2:43 AM - wildgoosespeeder: here's an example of a map you should not create, or at least, release publicly: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=267036502
2:43 AM - p0rtalmaster: Ah yes, another maze chamber.
2:44 AM - p0rtalmaster: I've also seen turretfests and empty tests of sorts...
2:44 AM - wildgoosespeeder: i can't tell you how many times i had to tell people it sounds good on paper but in practice, its not puzzling, just tedious and walking everywhere
2:45 AM - wildgoosespeeder: i immediately vote down and never play
2:45 AM - p0rtalmaster: Say, if you had to pick a type of PeTI test that had to repeat itself over and over again (through various users), which one would it be?
2:46 AM - wildgoosespeeder: what does that mean?
2:46 AM - p0rtalmaster: Well let's see... there are mazes...
2:46 AM - p0rtalmaster: turretfests, where turrets get blown up
2:46 AM - wildgoosespeeder: laser relay madness
2:46 AM - p0rtalmaster: playground maps
2:46 AM - wildgoosespeeder: not choosing
2:47 AM - wildgoosespeeder: just mentioning
2:47 AM - p0rtalmaster: I knew that ;)
2:47 AM - p0rtalmaster: ...many elements, not so much of a puzzle...
2:47 AM - wildgoosespeeder: annoying turrets
2:47 AM - p0rtalmaster: or anything else Inferno style, for that matter :P
2:48 AM - wildgoosespeeder: cube-gathering
2:48 AM - wildgoosespeeder: copycats
2:48 AM - p0rtalmaster: "Create ____ character with the voxel system"
2:48 AM - p0rtalmaster: ...and at the bottom of the list, we find actual puzzles that we TWP members like.
2:49 AM - wildgoosespeeder: oh yeah, ugly voxel characters
2:49 AM - wildgoosespeeder: 1%! FUCKING 1% TWP maps
2:49 AM - p0rtalmaster: ...and only one theme out of about 10 :P
2:50 AM - wildgoosespeeder: here's another test theme: no rhyme or reason
2:50 AM - p0rtalmaster: Speedrunning/skill tests
2:51 AM - p0rtalmaster: yeah, it's no wonder about 1% of the maps on the workshop are gems.
2:51 AM - p0rtalmaster: I read something at www.thinkwithportals.com that predicted this.
2:51 AM - wildgoosespeeder: oh yeah, dont forget in-game editor remakes of valve maps!
2:52 AM - wildgoosespeeder: BEEMOD like crazy maps
2:52 AM - p0rtalmaster: Cube.  Button.  End of test.  I can't think of anything more without my mind frying.
2:52 AM - p0rtalmaster: Oh and crushers :P
2:52 AM - wildgoosespeeder: walk-a-thons
2:52 AM - p0rtalmaster: Wow...I really got us brainstorming!
2:53 AM - wildgoosespeeder: all these chambers we mention, minus the TWP liked maps, are mind-numbing!
2:53 AM - wildgoosespeeder: "my first chamber" maps
2:53 AM - p0rtalmaster: And don't even get be started with the "my first time in Hammer" maps :P
2:55 AM - p0rtalmaster: http://www.thinkwithportals.com/blog.php?id=7921&p=1, second paragraph
2:55 AM - wildgoosespeeder: claiming that in-game editor maps are a work of art
2:55 AM - p0rtalmaster: :O
2:55 AM - wildgoosespeeder: *cough*hammer*cough*
2:56 AM - wildgoosespeeder: cave is wrong about "some"
2:56 AM - p0rtalmaster: Read: many
3:05 AM - wildgoosespeeder: http://i.imgur.com/siGsfYU.gif <--toward the people who make these shitty maps
3:06 AM - p0rtalmaster: ...and refuse to change them.
3:06 AM - p0rtalmaster: I can think of a few people already.
3:06 AM - wildgoosespeeder: oh yeah
3:06 AM - wildgoosespeeder: its like, i come here to have fun in portal 2 and your test design sucks it all out
3:07 AM - p0rtalmaster: Frankly, I feel that way not only with the common case of crappy maps, but also maps that are too brainy, such as toncica's stuff.
3:07 AM - p0rtalmaster: It's a delicate balance.
3:10 AM - wildgoosespeeder: the harder versions of here base level maps are like: http://i.imgur.com/T2zE3wx.gif
3:11 AM - p0rtalmaster: Image does not exist.  You were saying?
3:14 AM - wildgoosespeeder: it was disney's hunchback, with Claude Frollo screaming "Witchcraft"
3:16 AM - wildgoosespeeder: saving this conversation
3:16 AM - p0rtalmaster: OK.  That was some good brainstorming.
3:19 AM - wildgoosespeeder: there really needs to be a shitty map purge
3:19 AM - wildgoosespeeder: we have 350000+ maps
3:19 AM - wildgoosespeeder: quality over quantity should be strived for but is the reverse
3:20 AM - p0rtalmaster: Of course then the largest Steam Workshop would then be Garry's Mod.
3:20 AM - wildgoosespeeder: oh yeah, maps that have to activate everything to exit
3:21 AM - p0rtalmaster: Actually, that's kinda nice to know when there's an abundance of testing elements.
3:21 AM - wildgoosespeeder: there needs to be a rating system to rate difficulty, exploitability, and fanatic levels
3:22 AM - wildgoosespeeder: not popularity
3:22 AM - p0rtalmaster: That would help.
3:22 AM - wildgoosespeeder: people are judging the maps wrong
3:23 AM - wildgoosespeeder: i can say the test is easy or medium but i really dont know because i dont know the actual results from playtests
3:23 AM - wildgoosespeeder: from the people that play
3:23 AM - wildgoosespeeder: comments can be a little vague
3:23 AM - p0rtalmaster: If I were to rate a PeTI test...
3:23 AM - p0rtalmaster: It would probably be on difficulty and enjoyability.
3:24 AM - wildgoosespeeder: i remember a member, grim death?, really critiqued maps
3:24 AM - p0rtalmaster: I remember him too.
3:24 AM - p0rtalmaster: pouncing_DEATH was one of his aliases iirc.
3:25 AM - wildgoosespeeder: i think he indirectly inspired me to comment
3:25 AM - wildgoosespeeder: like he did
3:25 AM - p0rtalmaster: Me too.
3:26 AM - wildgoosespeeder: "rollercoaster" maps!
3:26 AM - wildgoosespeeder: another type
3:26 AM - p0rtalmaster: Of course!
3:26 AM - wildgoosespeeder: those i just want to scream hammer with real track and portals!
3:26 AM - p0rtalmaster: Platformer/Parkour maps
3:27 AM - p0rtalmaster: Now if I were to rate a Hammer test...
3:28 AM - wildgoosespeeder: batshit crazy blue gel maps
3:28 AM - p0rtalmaster: It would be on difficulty, artfulness, and overall satisfaction.
3:29 AM - p0rtalmaster: Never played those blue gel maps afaik.
3:30 AM - wildgoosespeeder: "to kill a turret" maps where someone thinks of ways to kill turrets when you should just walk to the exit since it is open anyways from the get go and within walking capacity (no puzzle)
3:30 AM - wildgoosespeeder: too many companion cube maps
3:30 AM - wildgoosespeeder: frankenturret maps
3:30 AM - p0rtalmaster: "Rube Goldberg" maps
3:30 AM - wildgoosespeeder: why is that even an item in the in-game editor
3:30 AM - wildgoosespeeder: there is one rube goldberg map that was decently interetsing
3:31 AM - wildgoosespeeder: it is a top rated all time map
3:31 AM - wildgoosespeeder: single player
3:31 AM - p0rtalmaster: Chainbuilder?
3:31 AM - wildgoosespeeder: yeah
3:31 AM - p0rtalmaster: I'm actually talking about the "behind the glass" RG maps.
3:31 AM - wildgoosespeeder: well, ive seen them and similar
3:32 AM - p0rtalmaster: Also, frankenturrets are a legitamite item because, unlike the other cubes, they can walk in a straight line.
3:34 AM - wildgoosespeeder: but valve made tests with them as if they were regular cubes that wheatley screwed up
3:34 AM - wildgoosespeeder: i find their walking use quite limited
3:35 AM - p0rtalmaster: It could be that you've never seen them in a puzzle.  IIRC it was Sheridan.Vespo. who created a mini-series called "FrankenScience."
3:36 AM - wildgoosespeeder: ive played only a handful of interesting frankenturret maps
3:37 AM - wildgoosespeeder: http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198055753328/myworkshopfiles/?appid=620
3:37 AM - wildgoosespeeder: did one
3:37 AM - p0rtalmaster: It seems the key to making them interesting is always a laserfield.
3:38 AM - wildgoosespeeder: kind of see what i am saying