Quote from Ralen on February 1, 2008, 9:56 pm

Okay, I've played through the first level of the map, and I've got some constructive comments.

First of all, I did have to cheat (i.e. read your walkthrough) for a portion of the second room. Part of my confusion in the second room was actually caused by the dots. I saw the "2" dot panel right away, and spent the next several minutes looking for a "1" dot panel to start with. I never noticed the 1 dot panel in the first room, and mentally I considered the second room to be its own entity, rather than a continuation of the beginning. It took me quite a while to figure out where to start.

I never noticed a "cube-friendly" sign for the fizzler in the second room, but as it turns out it wasn't necessary, as it's entirely possible to get the cube where it needs to go just by using portals and buttons.

The fling past the turret at the 3 dot panel never would have occured to me, and I don't think having a second 3 dot panel at the appropriate frictionless surface would be spelling it out too much for the player.

I enjoyed the "obstacle course" as you put it, and although it took me several tries to get it right, it was never too frustrating. I always had a clear idea of what I was supposed to do, but just had to work on getting it right.

For the final fling, I had to use some portal tunneling in order to get my portals in the correct position [spoiler]one at the bottom of the roller-mine pit, and one at the energy ball creator[/spoiler]. I don't know if that was your intended solution or not, but I couldn't think of any other way to get the portals in the right place.

I think your map was overall very ingenious, and I thought the initial "training" with the turrets was very effective and portal-like. Sliding around on the frictionless surface was fun, and I'd like to see it implemented in more ways.

Edit: Oh yeah, one more thing (for the first level, I haven't played the others yet). Immediately after the first fizzler when you're looking up at the 3 dot turret, GlaDOS's voice is unusually low in volume and difficult to hear.

Edit2: I've played the 2nd two levels now. A little tricky, but not overly challenging. With the glass wall just before the door to the third level though, it's possible to lose your companion cube on the other side, and then be stuck.

Quote from Nacimota on February 1, 2008, 10:44 pm

This thread looks like a declassified CIA file

Quote from xitooner on February 1, 2008, 10:50 pm

Ralen wrote:

I never noticed a "cube-friendly" sign for the fizzler in the second room, but as it turns out it wasn't necessary, as it's entirely possible to get the cube where it needs to go just by using portals and buttons.

Yeah, one thing I've noticed is that many people do not want to fling with cubes in-hand, so I made sure there was a way to do it both ways.

I've been undecided about having dots at the #3 puzzles tart, but since so many people get confused in there, I am going to add it. As you said, it really doesnt spoil the puzzle. I'll check into the lower voice. . .there is one other voice I need to rephrase anyway, so I might as well do 2 while I am at it.

Oh yeah; sounds like you did the final fling just as I expected. If someone wanted to do it in least-portals mode, it is possible to make a run back into the first room past the turrets just from running/hopping fast enough. . .but you have to do it just right.

Thanks for all the useful comments! I plan to put out a version this weekend that is updated for many of the quirks people have found so far. . .

Quote from xitooner on February 6, 2008, 8:20 pm

New version has been uploaded. (And hey; doing that reset my downnload count to zero! Bummer!)

Beta Version 2:
- Now includes demos for all areas. So now those of you who wanted to see my intended solution for the last puzzle of "Breaking The Rules" can now see.

- Much more signage to help people navigate area1's open room; make sure to look for descriptive scrawlings to tell you where to go, what to do, etc.

- Moved a few walls, eliminated at least 6 ways to avoid doing the intended puzzles (man, you playtesters are inventive!)

At this point I'll probably start working on those other 5 puzzles I have in mind, so I can get this moved to release. . .

Quote from Adair on February 8, 2008, 6:35 am

At this point I'm just trying to avoid the intended solutions to see what I can get away with.

[spoiler]In the second room I can still entirely avoid some of the slides.
To get up to the first ledge I shot blue at the top of slide #3. Then went to the very corner of the room under the ball shooter and looked towards the first ledge, then looked down and shot orange as close to the first ledge as possible. I then ran forward, and jump+crouched into the orange portal making me fly out of blue far enough that I could replace blue at the bottom of slide #3 and use air control to go straight down back into blue. This sent me flying out of orange high enough to get onto the first ledge. I then got up to the ball shooter the normal way with slide #3. Then with the cube on the big button up there I shot orange onto the slanted platform across the room. I released the energy ball and jumped off the ledge as far as possible shooting blue at the small area at the bottom of slide #3 while falling and fell through it at enough of an angle to shoot out of orange up to the glass ledge button. I then solved the rest of the room as intended.[/spoiler]

I'll probably play it again later to see if I can find anything else.

Quote from xitooner on February 8, 2008, 12:05 pm

Adair wrote:

[spoiler]In the second room I can still entirely avoid some of the slides.
To get up to the first ledge I shot blue at the top of slide #3. Then went to the very corner of the room under the ball shooter and looked towards the first ledge, then looked down and shot orange as close to the first ledge as possible.....[/spoiler]

Thats certainly a different approach. Of all the slides, #3 is certainly the most useful for doing extra tricks. But as long as you are using the slides in some way now, I dont think I mind.

Quote:

[spoiler]Then with the cube on the big button up there I shot orange onto the slanted platform across the room. I released the energy ball and jumped off the ledge as far as possible shooting blue at the small area at the bottom of slide #3 while falling and fell through it at enough of an angle to shoot out of orange up to the glass ledge button.[/spoiler]

Thats a heck of a jump; I'll have to try that one out.

Quote from Adair on February 8, 2008, 12:25 pm

xitooner wrote:

Thats certainly a different approach. Of all the slides, #3 is certainly the most useful for doing extra tricks. But as long as you are using the slides in some way now, I dont think I mind.

[spoiler]I don't exactly use the slide there, I sort of fly over it without touching it so that I can drop straight down into the portal at the bottom. But whatever, details details.[/spoiler]

Quote from Adair on February 9, 2008, 9:25 pm

I just watched all the demos you provided.

Demo 1: [spoiler]When I replayed just before watching I went back past the long line of turrets to get out of the second room for the first time and was going to tell you about it, but then realized you already know, before I was doing tunneling to get the portals in place for the final fling before Part 2.[/spoiler]

Demo 2: [spoiler]You played this rather different than I have been playing it. First difference is once I fling over the first pool I line up a shot through the area with no glass to shoot the wall where you set up the fling to go over the really tall glass wall. Also if you get close enough to the edge there you can actually shoot the ceiling on the starting side of the pool to avoid having to tunnel.
It never occured to me to then portal back over to the starting area and use that low down-slanted ceiling to get past the turrets and solve the puzzle with the long horizontal fizzler. Interesting that the turrets take no notice of you when you're just popping your head out.[/spoiler]

Demo 3: There's not nearly as much opportunity for variation on successfully solving these puzzles.

Edit: BTW, its possible to beat the entire map without any use of portal tunneling. I just figured that out.

Quote from rellikpd on February 10, 2008, 5:43 am

just played the updated version, very good. although some of the "jumps" seem much harder now lol even though i was doing the orriginal map the "appropriate" way, i still don't know how to do the downward-angle area (right before area 3 (last area)) i still [spoiler]stand on the cube and shoot a portal over the fizzler to the ceiling across, then throw my cube in a different portal at an angle and jump through myself. please, someone post a video on the "proper" way to beat this area?[/spoiler]

i personally think all the extra signage is babying us. and make the map look ugly (especially the [spoiler]race the ball[/spoiler] sign) the rest look ok, i got a chuckle out of the [spoiler]ramp diagram on the first real slide-test[/spoiler]

but personally i think its too much, the OTHER changes look great though, i think this map should be moved to the "released" section :-p as it seems complete.

unless you have more instore :-/ i mean if you want this as part of a map pack fine. but you could just realease 1 map at a time, and just make all your maps go into a maps/[sub-folder-name-here] and use .bns's

anyway. i'd love to see more and different maps from you. bring'em'on. even if they are just partial maps and stuff. i'd like to see your work.

edit: oh yeah, demos nevermind on the video request *goes and watches the demos*

2nd edit: still love this map, but after watching your "solution" for the down-ward-angled area with the fizzler (right before area 3) i think that part was lame, and i doubt many people woulda figured it out on their own, sorry. cuz EVERYTHING else is kick ass. also its funny watching other people solve stuff. lol some of the ways you portal through this seem SOOO inefficient, which is funny, cuz, since its YOUR map you'd think you'd take all the shortcuts (not hacks/ninjas/bypasses, just shortcuts)

anyway, still love the map :-p
but i hate that angled wall.

3rd edit:

Adair wrote:

Edit: BTW, its possible to beat the entire map without any use of portal tunneling. I just figured that out.

um... is it? for "sure"? i don't see how? but i guess that would depend on how you define "tunneling" by tunneling do you ONLY mean that you are standing "IN" a portal while shooting a different portal and when that portal lands you are still standing "IN" the orrginal portal? if so. maybe, to me tunneling is THAT definition PLUS: If you are standing outside (lets say an orange) portal and shoot a new orange portal to a far away wall then "QUICKLY" step through the orange before the (flying)-orange portal lands.... to me that is still tunneling. cuz you are creating portals to areas you wouldn't be able to get to/through just by walking/jumping/portaling, the only difference in these two definitions is that with the first you can stand "IN/ON" a wall, and with the 2nd you would need "some" sort of "place" to stand. other than that they work the same.

so i dunno.