OCD Mappers

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satchmo
415 Posts
Posted Aug 12, 2011
Am I the only one who aligns everything in a map? I mean, including the invisible entities such as logic_relay and toggle_texture?

I admit I have this little OCD thing going on. All the point entities have to be equal distance from adjacent brushes and entities. All of them have to be at the same height.

Everything on my desk are also perfectly aligned and at 90-degree intervals in their rotation. If anyone touches an object on my desk, I would know about it, because it's misaligned.

I have a ruler for such purpose.

That's one reason you won't see any destroyed chamber style maps from me. The skewed angles just bother me too much. I like everything neat, tidy, and in perfect alignment.

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iWork925
1,080 Posts
Posted Aug 12, 2011
Replied 49 minutes later
I like your ideals. I will download and play your maps in your sig. I am like this too.
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WinstonSmith
940 Posts
Posted Aug 12, 2011
Replied 42 minutes later
Raises hand slowly

I do so many of these things. I do align logic/point entities to the grid (and usually next to each other in straight lines) whenever I map. I'm not as obsessive in real life, but I do have a fondness for cleaning things and reorganizing them.

For the record it is a bit comforting that a doctor is a bit of a perfectionist.

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ForbiddenDonut
142 Posts
Posted Aug 12, 2011
Replied 1 hour later
I agree, although, like Winston, it's not really an OCD thing than rather a desire to keep my maps clean and organized. Also, being a programming student has really forced me to organize a lot better no matter what I'm doing.

What really gets me is when people try to use non-quadrilateral/90 degree shapes in their maps, like cylinders or other odd geometry. There's a few exceptions (Old Aperture underground elevator shafts), but most of the time the textures (which were designed for perpendicular walls/ceilings) just look like crap.

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Rubrica
305 Posts
Posted Aug 12, 2011
Replied 1 hour later
I actually have OCPD (it's like OCD, but without the compulsive onnapropriatw thoughts), so every map I make is like this. It's probably the reason why I've never yet finished a map, though I'm getting close. I'm telling you, making neat ramps is a NIGHTMARE (though, as usual, Pythagoras' theorem is useful).
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ChickenMobile
2,460 Posts
Posted Aug 12, 2011
Replied 1 hour later
Raises hand slowly after WS

If only I could stop at the point where everything looks reasonable instead of absolutely perfect in my eyes. Though keeping everything absolutely perpendicular is too much work! I have my VAPD currently at 22? with my pen on it at 15?. Drawing tablet at 2?... > WinstonSmith wrote:

I do align logic/point entities to the grid (and usually next to each other in straight lines) whenever I map.

Same, but I always thought that the .bsp would gain more data by putting it to not the grid, as it's coordinates would be something like "52.34bladf 3.84bla89 4.73bla3" instead of "52 3 4". I doubt it would change much though. A couple of bytes maybe?

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NuclearDuckie
186 Posts
Posted Aug 12, 2011
Replied 10 minutes later

chickenmobile wrote:
I always thought that the .bsp would gain more data by putting it to not the grid, as it's coordinates would be something like "52.34bladf 3.84bla89 4.73bla3" instead of "52 3 4". I doubt it would change much though. A couple of bytes maybe?

I recall a help manual for Adobe Flash saying that the computer finds it easier to process if you input powers of 2 to filter properties.

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ChickenMobile
2,460 Posts
Posted Aug 12, 2011
Replied 7 minutes later

NuclearDuckie wrote:
chickenmobile wrote:

I always thought that the .bsp would gain more data by putting it to not the grid, as it's coordinates would be something like "52.34bladf 3.84bla89 4.73bla3" instead of "52 3 4". I doubt it would change much though. A couple of bytes maybe?

I recall a help manual for Adobe Flash saying that the computer finds it easier to process if you input powers of 2 to filter properties.

You shouldn't have said that. I have a sudden urge to put all my entities in a spot that is a power of 2. :lol:

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ForbiddenDonut
142 Posts
Posted Aug 12, 2011
Replied 14 minutes later
Now that's optimization. :lol:
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morrock
23 Posts
Posted Aug 12, 2011
Replied 23 minutes later
lol, the powers of 2 thing is usually just for memory limits and whatnot. Though I remember reading somewhere that the bsp algorithm in Source is more optimized if you try to constrain room sizes and and wall widths to powers of 2. I believe that. Also positions are always saved to 32 bits, regardless, so snapping to a grid shouldn't save map data. The origin isn't 0, it's 0.000000. It's compiled into a bytecode anyways, so it's actually 0x000000.

I map like a programmer, so no, my maps look good once compiled, but they're a mess otherwise. Non-visible point entities are placed in a logical fashion, but never too organized.

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satchmo
415 Posts
Posted Aug 12, 2011
Replied 1 hour later
All my brushes are aligned and sized to the power of 2, and the distances (maximum range for turret and ambient_generic range) are always to the power of 2. I am obsessed about those numbers. 256, 1024, 64 . . . they make me feel good for some reason.

And any multiples of the number 13 bothers me. For example, one of my maps has been rated 13 times. I am just on edge until someone rates it again one more time so it's not 13 or 26.

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Marise
249 Posts
Posted Aug 12, 2011
Replied 43 minutes later
I started out not paying much attention to how the brushes were aligned, and based on feedback here I started caring. Now I am trying to finish a map which I began before I knew the importance of sticking to the grid, and it's been a real hair-pulling experience getting things lined up. Not about to rebuild the whole thing! And it's a decayed theme map, so I'm also working on details like foliage. I have spent way more time on the visuals than on the puzzles and I'm still not 100% happy with it.
:notwant:

My next map will be perfectly fit to the grid and aligned from the start.

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MasterLagger
1,695 Posts
Posted Aug 12, 2011
Replied 34 minutes later
I also realize that people whine about tiles not being aligned properly, and I don't mean so out of line that it is obvious, I mean the person actually took a photo show the wall tiles being half cut near the floor, it was also aligned with everything else in the room. I fixed the entire map so the tiles were whole tiles and aligned but still, I've seen tiles cut in stranger places.

I think we have a few OCD Players as well.

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HMW
806 Posts
Posted Aug 12, 2011
Replied 28 minutes later
*** Raises hand slowly after chickenmobile ***

Yes, I do that too, compulsively. Everything has to be aligned to a 16-interval grid or I get this... itch! I put all brush entity origins at the center too if they're not used as pivot points.
(It does actually look less cluttered in Hammer's 2d views.)

On the other hand, grouping things like relays together according to function is an actual good idea if you are making anything slightly complicated.

I'm not as obsessed about textures being 1 pixel off, unless it's easily fixable. (Some of my maps have angled walls where it's nearly impossible to get a whole number of tiles on the wall, due to rounding errors.)

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satchmo
415 Posts
Posted Aug 12, 2011
Replied 1 minute later
If the textures are not lined up, the size of the brush is probably the culprit.

You have to create brushes in dimensions that fit the power of 2's, and of course, completely sticking to the grid. Never decrease the grid to less than 8 unless in a few situations (fizzler, laser field, etc), and use a grid of 16 or more the majority of the times.

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ChickenMobile
2,460 Posts
Posted Aug 12, 2011
Replied 5 minutes later

satchmo wrote:
You have to create brushes in dimensions that fit the power of 2's, and of course, completely sticking to the grid. Never decrease the grid to less than 8 unless in a few situations (fizzler, laser field, etc), and use a grid of 16 or more the majority of the times.

8 is a good grid size to stick to, however I use the minimum grid size for accurately positioning models or in some cases, vertices on oblong shapes (which coincidently fit into models). I would never use ALT+Move in order to get something to the right position. It seems... wrong.
:shrug:

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MasterLagger
1,695 Posts
Posted Aug 12, 2011
Replied 4 hours later
Minor complications cause me to use ALT+Move, but rarely.
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Vordwann
767 Posts
Posted Aug 12, 2011
Replied 2 hours later
Recently I have been organising/aligning my point entities a lot...
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satchmo
415 Posts
Posted Aug 12, 2011
Replied 1 hour later
Just wait when the drug reps for SSRI's get a wind of this thread . . .
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Mevious
205 Posts
Posted Aug 12, 2011
Replied 16 minutes later
I used to fall into the trap of wanting everything to be perfect back when I mapped for hl1 and 2. One day I realized I was wasting my time aligning point entities and making sure everything was organized and perfectly named. I made a conscious effort to break out of the pattern of attemped perfection and my productivity shot way up. I was suddenly able to actually finish things rather than obscess over tiny details, and I haven't regretted it.

Instances help a lot with this because they allow you to quickly make an isolated feature and not care how messy it is in the context of your maps.