BSP Size

SpAM_CAN

103 Posts

Posted Jul 23, 2012

Is there any simple way of reducing BSP size? I'm at 70mb already, I've only just finished the first area, and I've got a whole load of dialogue and a couple of signs to add to that BSP later. Is there any simple way of reducing the BSP size? (I'm assuming we can't use BZIP2 or something, and I know the contest rules say it has to be uncompressed)

josepezdj

2,386 Posts

#81606

Posted Jul 23, 2012

Replied 33 minutes later

Only thing I can think of is to revise all your custom content: signage, textures and such... and use a different compression format when turning them into a .vtf file format... For example I (and also Valve does) use DXT5(common) because it's "cheaper" than the rest while graphics quality is still good ...

ChickenMobile

2,460 Posts

#81608

Posted Jul 23, 2012

Replied 5 minutes later

Whoa. How big can your map be to get to 70mb in just a compile? Mine is a large map and it is only 20MB at the current moment (full compile including packed custom content)

A few things you can do to reduce bsp size:
Optimising
Lowering lightmap scales
Nodrawing not-seen brush faces. This applies to func_details the most.
Converting sounds to mp3's and compressing custom textures (best compression allowed with a vtf)
Minimising custom textures and content as much as possible. If there is a similar default texture, use it!
Reducing the amount of brushes in your map
Using LOD model versions for distant models
Use cheap textures for distant textures (if available)
Use dynamic lighting (or real-time lighting) in appropriate places.
Remove unnecessary props and brushes.

SpAM_CAN

103 Posts

#81611

Posted Jul 23, 2012

Replied 27 minutes later

I'll try lowering the lightmap scales and stuff, because this doesn't even have the custom content packed in yet... Its just once Science Sphere and a cavern, so... xD

Thanks for the tips, I'll try to cut some things down.

EDIT: Do displacements increase the filesize loads? That'd be one cause for the problem

josepezdj

2,386 Posts

#81614

Posted Jul 23, 2012

Replied 25 minutes later

ChickenMobile wrote:
Whoa. How big can your map be to get to 70mb in just a compile? Mine is a large map and it is only 20MB at the current moment (full compile including packed custom content)

My maps use to be that around too... when I include the custom content (around 17MB when not...)

SpAM_CAN

103 Posts

#81637

Posted Jul 23, 2012

Replied 6 hours later

Designed the second area and its only gone up to 73mb. Custom signs so far only take up about 2mb, so hopefully I can get the size down a bit further and get everything in the 100mb.

Just a question, is the 100mb limit imposed by the Workshop or by TWP?

ChickenMobile

2,460 Posts

#81647

Posted Jul 23, 2012

Replied 42 minutes later

I believed that this was a good size to limit it at. Workshop limits at 200mb, however not everyone wants to download 50 150mb+ maps.

So I think this is both beneficial for us and the community.

SpAM_CAN

103 Posts

#81654

Posted Jul 23, 2012

Replied 34 minutes later

Nono, its a good limit really, I just wondered

BEARD!

169 Posts

#81655

Posted Jul 23, 2012

Replied 9 minutes later

I raised the issue in IRC.
How complicated are your visleafs - are they a real mess?
Do you have lots of named light entities?
Are you using loads of cubemaps?

It's difficult to say why your BSP is huge without much extra information. Could you post a compile log? There should be one in the same folder as your VMF.

You might want to try compiling the map with various visgroups (for example, World Details) turned off. Perhaps that will identify a cause for the filesize. Is there a means to compile with displacements turned off? That would test your theory that they are responsible. Try using 'H' to quick-hide selected objects for a compile (you can unhide with U).

SpAM_CAN

103 Posts

#81657

Posted Jul 23, 2012

Replied 14 minutes later

Thing is, it doesn't even have cubemaps yet (when i tried to build them i got access denied errors and things, so i'll try that again later.)

Visleaf wise it doesn't seem too bad... I'll try turning more things into details (being an underground map there are lots of skinny panels, but i know that turning EVERYTHING to detail can make it worse, so i left a load of the bigger panels as world brushes).

There are two named light entites, but they have the same name. Might replace this with a ProjTex later and see if it improves much.

EDIT: As it takes a while to compile fully, i'll do Fast for now.

Without Disp Area: 31mb



materialPath: c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\portal2\materials
Loading c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.vmf
ConVarRef gpu_level doesn't point to an existing ConVar
Error! Variable &quot;$envmap&quot; is multiply defined in material &quot;metal/underground_wall_metal004a_bottom&quot;!
nummapplanes:&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;(&nbsp; 3332 / 65536 )
nummapbrushes:&nbsp; &nbsp; (&nbsp; &nbsp;401 /&nbsp; 8192 )
nummapbrushsides: (&nbsp; 3207 / 65536 )
num_map_overlays: (&nbsp; &nbsp; 18 /&nbsp; &nbsp;512 )
nummodels:&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;(&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0 /&nbsp; 1024 )
fixing up env_cubemap materials on brush sides...
0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...100...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10Processing areas...done (0)
Building Faces...done (0)
Chop Details...done (0)
Find Visible Detail Sides...
Merged 184 detail faces...done (0)
Merging details...done (0)
FixTjuncs...
PruneNodes...
WriteBSP...
done (1)
writing c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.prt...Building visibility clusters...
done (0)
Finding displacement neighbors...
Finding lightmap sample positions...
Displacement Alpha : 0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10
Building Physics collision data...
done (0) (161218 bytes)
Placing detail props : 0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10
Water found with no water_lod_control entity, creating a default one.
Compacting texture/material tables...
Reduced 959 texinfos to 562
Reduced 58 texdatas to 50 (2181 bytes to 1874)
Writing c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.bsp
4 seconds elapsed



6 threads
reading c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.bsp
reading c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.prt
 329 portalclusters
1264 numportals
0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...100...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...


materialPath: c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\portal2\materials
Loading c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.vmf
ConVarRef gpu_level doesn't point to an existing ConVar
Error! Variable &quot;$envmap&quot; is multiply defined in material &quot;metal/underground_wall_metal004a_bottom&quot;!
nummapplanes:&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;(&nbsp; 3332 / 65536 )
nummapbrushes:&nbsp; &nbsp; (&nbsp; &nbsp;401 /&nbsp; 8192 )
nummapbrushsides: (&nbsp; 3207 / 65536 )
num_map_overlays: (&nbsp; &nbsp; 18 /&nbsp; &nbsp;512 )
nummodels:&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;(&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0 /&nbsp; 1024 )
fixing up env_cubemap materials on brush sides...
0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...100...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10Processing areas...done (0)
Building Faces...done (0)
Chop Details...done (0)
Find Visible Detail Sides...
Merged 184 detail faces...done (0)
Merging details...done (0)
FixTjuncs...
PruneNodes...
WriteBSP...
done (0)
writing c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.prt...Building visibility clusters...
done (0)
Finding displacement neighbors...
Finding lightmap sample positions...
Displacement Alpha : 0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10
Building Physics collision data...
done (0) (161218 bytes)
Placing detail props : 0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10
Water found with no water_lod_control entity, creating a default one.
Compacting texture/material tables...
Reduced 959 texinfos to 562
Reduced 58 texdatas to 50 (2181 bytes to 1874)
Writing c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.bsp
7 seconds elapsed



6 threads
reading c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.bsp
reading c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.prt
 329 portalclusters
1264 numportals
0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10Optimized: 26 visible clusters (0.00%)
Total clusters visible: 79545
Average clusters visible: 241
Building PAS...
Average clusters audible: 243
visdatasize:24724&nbsp; compressed from 31584
writing c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.bsp
0 seconds elapsed



[Reading texlights from 'lights.rad']
[59 texlights parsed from 'lights.rad']

Loading c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.bsp
3586 faces
2343470 square feet [337459776.00 square inches]
0 Displacements
0 Square Feet [0.00 Square Inches]
3586 patches before subdivision
232258 patches after subdivision
46 direct lights
0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...100...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10transfers 11209151, max 1170
transfer lists:&nbsp; 85.5 megs
0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10&nbsp; &nbsp;Bounce #1 added RGB(12330, 10147, 5582)
0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10&nbsp; &nbsp;Bounce #2 added RGB(2594, 1805, 669)
Build Patch/Sample Hash Table(s).....Done&lt;0.4452 sec&gt;
0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10FinalLightFace Done
0 of 0 (0% of) surface lights went in leaf ambient cubes.
0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10Writing leaf ambient...done
Ready to Finish

Object names&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;Objects/Maxobjs&nbsp; Memory / Maxmem&nbsp; Fullness 
------------&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;---------------&nbsp; ---------------&nbsp; -------- 
models&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 46/1024&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;2208/49152&nbsp; &nbsp; ( 4.5%) 
brushes&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 401/8192&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;4812/98304&nbsp; &nbsp; ( 4.9%) 
brushsides&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 3208/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;25664/524288&nbsp; &nbsp;( 4.9%) 
planes&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 3374/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;67480/1310720&nbsp; ( 5.1%) 
vertexes&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 3676/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;44112/786432&nbsp; &nbsp;( 5.6%) 
nodes&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;1060/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;33920/2097152&nbsp; ( 1.6%) 
texinfos&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;562/12288&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;40464/884736&nbsp; &nbsp;( 4.6%) 
texdata&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;50/2048&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;1600/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; ( 2.4%) 
dispinfos&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
disp_verts&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
disp_tris&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
disp_multiblend&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
disp_lmsamples&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
faces&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;3586/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 200816/3670016&nbsp; ( 5.5%) 
hdr faces&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 0/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/3670016&nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
origfaces&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;1255/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;70280/3670016&nbsp; ( 1.9%) 
facebrushes&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 124/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;248/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
facebrushlists&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 3586/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;14344/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
leaves&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1107/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;35424/2097152&nbsp; ( 1.7%) 
leaffaces&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;7137/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;14274/131072&nbsp; &nbsp;(10.9%) 
leafbrushes&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 833/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1666/131072&nbsp; &nbsp;( 1.3%) 
areas&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4/256&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 32/2048&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;( 1.6%) 
surfedges&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 20472/512000&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 81888/2048000&nbsp; ( 4.0%) 
edges&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 11443/256000&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 45772/1024000&nbsp; ( 4.5%) 
LDR worldlights&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;46/8192&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;4600/819200&nbsp; &nbsp;( 0.6%) 
HDR worldlights&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 0/8192&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 0/819200&nbsp; &nbsp;( 0.0%) 
leafwaterdata&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2/32768&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 24/393216&nbsp; &nbsp;( 0.0%) 
waterstrips&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 182/32768&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1820/327680&nbsp; &nbsp;( 0.6%) 
waterverts&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/786432&nbsp; &nbsp;( 0.0%) 
waterindices&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2883/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 5766/131072&nbsp; &nbsp;( 4.4%) 
cubemapsamples&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 10/1024&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 160/16384&nbsp; &nbsp; ( 1.0%) 
overlays&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 18/512&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 6336/180224&nbsp; &nbsp;( 3.5%) 
LDR lightdata&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;[variable]&nbsp; &nbsp; 29703832/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
HDR lightdata&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;[variable]&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
visdata&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;[variable]&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;24724/16777216 ( 0.1%) 
entdata&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;[variable]&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;95302/393216&nbsp; &nbsp;(24.2%) 
LDR ambient table&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;1107/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4428/262144&nbsp; &nbsp;( 1.7%) 
HDR ambient table&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;1107/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4428/262144&nbsp; &nbsp;( 1.7%) 
LDR leaf ambient&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4334/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 121352/1835008&nbsp; ( 6.6%) 
HDR leaf ambient&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1107/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;30996/1835008&nbsp; ( 1.7%) 
occluders&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
occluder polygons&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
occluder vert ind&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
detail props&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; [variable]&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;1/12&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;( 8.3%) 
static props&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; [variable]&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;1/51166&nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
pakfile&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;[variable]&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 822354/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
physics&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;[variable]&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 161218/4194304&nbsp; ( 3.8%) 
physics terrain&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;[variable]&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;2/1048576&nbsp; ( 0.0%) 

Level flags = 0

Total triangle count: 8256
Writing c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.bsp
50 seconds elapsed

With Disp Area: 34.8mb

materialPath: c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\portal2\materials
Loading c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.vmf
ConVarRef gpu_level doesn't point to an existing ConVar
Error! Variable &quot;$envmap&quot; is multiply defined in material &quot;metal/underground_wall_metal004a_bottom&quot;!
nummapplanes:&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;(&nbsp; 3332 / 65536 )
nummapbrushes:&nbsp; &nbsp; (&nbsp; &nbsp;401 /&nbsp; 8192 )
nummapbrushsides: (&nbsp; 3207 / 65536 )
num_map_overlays: (&nbsp; &nbsp; 18 /&nbsp; &nbsp;512 )
nummodels:&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;(&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0 /&nbsp; 1024 )
fixing up env_cubemap materials on brush sides...
0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...100...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10Processing areas...done (0)
Building Faces...done (0)
Chop Details...done (0)
Find Visible Detail Sides...
Merged 184 detail faces...done (0)
Merging details...done (0)
FixTjuncs...
PruneNodes...
WriteBSP...
done (0)
writing c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.prt...Building visibility clusters...
done (0)
Finding displacement neighbors...
Finding lightmap sample positions...
Displacement Alpha : 0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10
Building Physics collision data...
done (1) (161218 bytes)
Placing detail props : 0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10
Water found with no water_lod_control entity, creating a default one.
Compacting texture/material tables...
Reduced 959 texinfos to 562
Reduced 58 texdatas to 50 (2181 bytes to 1874)
Writing c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.bsp
3 seconds elapsed



6 threads
reading c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.bsp
reading c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.prt
 329 portalclusters
1264 numportals
0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10Optimized: 26 visible clusters (0.00%)
Total clusters visible: 79545
Average clusters visible: 241
Building PAS...
Average clusters audible: 243
visdatasize:24724&nbsp; compressed from 31584
writing c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.bsp
0 seconds elapsed



[Reading texlights from 'lights.rad']
[59 texlights parsed from 'lights.rad']

Loading c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.bsp



materialPath: c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\portal2\materials
Loading c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.vmf
ConVarRef gpu_level doesn't point to an existing ConVar
Error! Variable &quot;$envmap&quot; is multiply defined in material &quot;metal/underground_wall_metal004a_bottom&quot;!
nummapplanes:&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;(&nbsp; 4946 / 65536 )
nummapbrushes:&nbsp; &nbsp; (&nbsp; &nbsp;548 /&nbsp; 8192 )
nummapbrushsides: (&nbsp; 4721 / 65536 )
num_map_overlays: (&nbsp; &nbsp; 21 /&nbsp; &nbsp;512 )
nummodels:&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;(&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0 /&nbsp; 1024 )
fixing up env_cubemap materials on brush sides...
0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...100...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10Processing areas...done (0)
Building Faces...done (0)
Chop Details...done (0)
Find Visible Detail Sides...
Merged 216 detail faces...done (0)
Merging details...done (0)
FixTjuncs...
PruneNodes...
WriteBSP...
done (0)
writing c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.prt...Building visibility clusters...
done (0)
Finding displacement neighbors...
Finding lightmap sample positions...
Displacement Alpha : 0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10
Building Physics collision data...
done (1) (224485 bytes)
Placing detail props : 0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10
Water found with no water_lod_control entity, creating a default one.
Compacting texture/material tables...
Reduced 1588 texinfos to 760
Reduced 76 texdatas to 67 (2878 bytes to 2520)
Writing c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.bsp
5 seconds elapsed



6 threads
reading c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.bsp
reading c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.prt
 425 portalclusters
1495 numportals
0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10Optimized: 34 visible clusters (0.00%)
Total clusters visible: 88393
Average clusters visible: 207
Building PAS...
Average clusters audible: 209
visdatasize:29108&nbsp; compressed from 47600
writing c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.bsp
0 seconds elapsed



[Reading texlights from 'lights.rad']
[59 texlights parsed from 'lights.rad']

Loading c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.bsp
4053 faces
2708297 square feet [389994816.00 square inches]
14 Displacements
476273 Square Feet [68583336.00 Square Inches]
4053 patches before subdivision
264625 patches after subdivision
65 direct lights
0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...100...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10transfers 12615146, max 1170
transfer lists:&nbsp; 96.2 megs
0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10&nbsp; &nbsp;Bounce #1 added RGB(36815, 37624, 28172)
0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10&nbsp; &nbsp;Bounce #2 added RGB(9058, 7523, 3419)
Build Patch/Sample Hash Table(s).....Done&lt;1.0861 sec&gt;
0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10FinalLightFace Done
0 of 1 (0% of) surface lights went in leaf ambient cubes.
0...1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10Writing leaf ambient...done
Ready to Finish

Object names&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;Objects/Maxobjs&nbsp; Memory / Maxmem&nbsp; Fullness 
------------&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;---------------&nbsp; ---------------&nbsp; -------- 
models&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 57/1024&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;2736/49152&nbsp; &nbsp; ( 5.6%) 
brushes&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 548/8192&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;6576/98304&nbsp; &nbsp; ( 6.7%) 
brushsides&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4641/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;37128/524288&nbsp; &nbsp;( 7.1%) 
planes&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4998/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;99960/1310720&nbsp; ( 7.6%) 
vertexes&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4681/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;56172/786432&nbsp; &nbsp;( 7.1%) 
nodes&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;1390/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;44480/2097152&nbsp; ( 2.1%) 
texinfos&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;760/12288&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;54720/884736&nbsp; &nbsp;( 6.2%) 
texdata&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;67/2048&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;2144/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; ( 3.3%) 
dispinfos&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;14/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2464/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
disp_verts&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4046/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;80920/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
disp_tris&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;7168/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;14336/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
disp_multiblend&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
disp_lmsamples&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 374290/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 374290/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
faces&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;4053/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 226968/3670016&nbsp; ( 6.2%) 
hdr faces&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 0/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/3670016&nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
origfaces&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;1576/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;88256/3670016&nbsp; ( 2.4%) 
facebrushes&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 130/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;260/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
facebrushlists&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4053/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;16212/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
leaves&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1448/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;46336/2097152&nbsp; ( 2.2%) 
leaffaces&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;7661/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;15322/131072&nbsp; &nbsp;(11.7%) 
leafbrushes&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;1178/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2356/131072&nbsp; &nbsp;( 1.8%) 
areas&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 5/256&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 40/2048&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;( 2.0%) 
surfedges&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 23988/512000&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 95952/2048000&nbsp; ( 4.7%) 
edges&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 13733/256000&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 54932/1024000&nbsp; ( 5.4%) 
LDR worldlights&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;65/8192&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;6500/819200&nbsp; &nbsp;( 0.8%) 
HDR worldlights&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 0/8192&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 0/819200&nbsp; &nbsp;( 0.0%) 
leafwaterdata&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 3/32768&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 36/393216&nbsp; &nbsp;( 0.0%) 
waterstrips&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 212/32768&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2120/327680&nbsp; &nbsp;( 0.6%) 
waterverts&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/786432&nbsp; &nbsp;( 0.0%) 
waterindices&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 3381/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 6762/131072&nbsp; &nbsp;( 5.2%) 
cubemapsamples&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 12/1024&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 192/16384&nbsp; &nbsp; ( 1.2%) 
overlays&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 21/512&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 7392/180224&nbsp; &nbsp;( 4.1%) 
LDR lightdata&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;[variable]&nbsp; &nbsp; 32623032/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
HDR lightdata&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;[variable]&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
visdata&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;[variable]&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;29108/16777216 ( 0.2%) 
entdata&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;[variable]&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 116104/393216&nbsp; &nbsp;(29.5%) 
LDR ambient table&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;1448/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 5792/262144&nbsp; &nbsp;( 2.2%) 
HDR ambient table&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;1448/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 5792/262144&nbsp; &nbsp;( 2.2%) 
LDR leaf ambient&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 5798/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 162344/1835008&nbsp; ( 8.8%) 
HDR leaf ambient&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1448/65536&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;40544/1835008&nbsp; ( 2.2%) 
occluders&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
occluder polygons&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
occluder vert ind&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;0/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
detail props&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; [variable]&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;1/12&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;( 8.3%) 
static props&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; [variable]&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;1/55636&nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
pakfile&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;[variable]&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 972954/0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0.0%) 
physics&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;[variable]&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 224485/4194304&nbsp; ( 5.4%) 
physics terrain&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;[variable]&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;11790/1048576&nbsp; ( 1.1%) 

Level flags = 0

Total triangle count: 9442
Writing c:\program files (x86)\steam\steamapps\common\portal 2\sdk_content\maps\sp_cavescaves.bsp
56 seconds elapsed

Not a gigantic jump but that could very well be the cause. I'll run on full tomorrow and test to see if the same rings true in Full, if not i'll delete that area and scale it down a tad.

josepezdj

2,386 Posts

#81700

Posted Jul 24, 2012

Replied 12 hours later

SpAM_CAN wrote:
Thing is, it doesn't even have cubemaps yet (when i tried to build them i got access denied errors and things, so i'll try that again later.)

In order to be able to build cubemaps you have to have a copy of the map into portal2_dlc2 folder (it's a bug since Valve released the first DLC) because that folder is where the game searches into. In fact you can modify your settings in hammer in order to make it ALWAYS save a copy of your recently compiled map into that folder so you don't have to do it manually each time.

SpAM_CAN

103 Posts

#81778

Posted Jul 24, 2012

Replied 12 hours later

Oh, thanks for the tip ^.^

Villethemina

40 Posts

#81828

Posted Jul 25, 2012

Replied 10 hours later

ChickenMobile wrote:
...blah blah blah...
Nodrawing not-seen brush faces. This applies to func_details the most.
...blah blah blah...

I'm a little late, but I read somewhere that with normal brushes that are outside the map (I mean the "outer" side of the map) it doesn't matter if they are nodraw or not since hammer doesn't compile(idk if that's the right word here) them anyways.

But yeah you probably meant brushes that are inside the map but not visible. And the later tip is very important especially if you have many func_details.

ChickenMobile

2,460 Posts

#81832

Posted Jul 25, 2012

Replied 2 hours later

Villethemina wrote:
I'm a little late, but I read somewhere that with normal brushes that are outside the map (I mean the "outer" side of the map) it doesn't matter if they are nodraw or not since hammer doesn't compile(idk if that's the right word here) them anyways.

That be true. This is also the case for world brushes faces which are sealed by other world brushes. Because func_details do not split leafs the engine may still render and create lighting for faces on not seen func_detail's sides.

If you ever go through Valve's maps. They usually are sloppy with the nodraw on world brushes, however very careful about where they put it on details.

HMW

806 Posts

#81854

Posted Jul 25, 2012

Replied 8 hours later

Large surfaces with high-res lightmaps can eat up space pretty fast too, especially when lit by a switching or blinking light source. (Multiple lighting states = multiple lightmaps.)

The fact that your fast compile produces a bsp of half the size compared to your full compile, points in this direction, I think.
(A fast compile creates lower lightmap resolutions than a standard or full one IIRC.)

SpAM_CAN

103 Posts

#81876

Posted Jul 25, 2012

Replied 3 hours later

Just the Science Sphere was 50mb. Managed to reduce that with optimisation, reducing the lightmap of everything to 32 (its fine, most of the lighting that needs shadows is ProjTex anyway, except for the goo which is at a lightmap of 8, might up it if i can fit everything in the 100mb). Got the sphere area down to 21mb on a full compile! :3

ChickenMobile

2,460 Posts

#81878

Posted Jul 25, 2012

Replied 3 minutes later

Hooray! Go you.

Vordwann

767 Posts

#81937

Posted Jul 26, 2012

Replied 14 hours later

SpAM_CAN wrote:
Visleaf wise it doesn't seem too bad... I'll try turning more things into details (being an underground map there are lots of skinny panels, but i know that turning EVERYTHING to detail can make it worse, so i left a load of the bigger panels as world brushes).

Just turning things into func_details does not fix your visleaves. You need to use other methods such as hint+skip, visclusters for large open areas, and (for BTS and Old Aperture especially) plenty of areaportals in the right places. Also make sure your nodraw behind the displacements is placed optimally for visleaves, but hint+skip should fix most of that.

msleeper

4,136 Posts

Admin

#81951

Posted Jul 26, 2012

Replied 4 hours later

I am reminded of something Nacimota said.

Quote:
There is so much misinformation going on in this thread that I almost started to doubt my own knowledge on the subject.

Okay a few things. Beard: What info did you get from IRC exactly? Because if someone told you that the number of visleaves would increase the filesize, they were wrong. I'm assuming you misunderstood what someone (me?) said.

Also:

ChickenMobile wrote:
A few things you can do to reduce bsp size:
Lowering lightmap scales This is the most useful; lightmaps take up a huge chunk of your BSP size
Nodrawing not-seen brush faces. This applies to func_details the most. This will have a negligible effect on file size. This only helps your in-game budget. And as was said previously, any non-detail brush face that is either facing the void or is completely covered (IE sides of brushes facing another wall) will be culled
Reducing the amount of brushes in your map This is only a partial solution; the reason it helps is because of fewer lightmap data
Using LOD model versions for distant models This has nothing to do with file size, again this just affects your in-game budget
Use cheap textures for distant textures (if available) Ditto
Use dynamic lighting (or real-time lighting) in appropriate places. Ditto
Remove unnecessary props and brushes. Ditto

Try compiling your map without VRAD and see if it still jumps up the filesize. And as others have said before, take some time to optimize your lightmaps. Anywhere that the player won't be able to access, or anywhere that doesn't need a sharp shadow being drawn on, lower the lightmap scale down.

Mevious

205 Posts

#81952

Posted Jul 26, 2012

Replied 6 minutes later

Vordwann wrote:
Just turning things into func_details does not fix your visleaves. You need to use other methods such as hint+skip, visclusters for large open areas, and (for BTS and Old Aperture especially) plenty of areaportals in the right places. Also make sure your nodraw behind the displacements is placed optimally for visleaves, but hint+skip should fix most of that.

Hint+skip brushes and areaportals are great for optimizing framerate (when used correctly), but I've never heard of them being used to lower bsp size. Visclusters speed up compile time by telling the compiler that all the visleafs inside the cluster can see each other, but again this data must be stored in the bsp, and I don't see how it would lower the bsp size. On the other hand, maybe I'm just oversimplifying everything and these actually are factors. If so, please provide source material so that I can get educated.

I think the biggest impacts you can have are:
1. Reduce the overall number of drawn faces in the map (Edit: this helps mostly due to removing lightmaps (#2))
2. Optimize lightmap scales (which it sounds like you are already working on)
3. Lower the quality and count of cubemaps (which you haven't added yet)

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