The map that I've been working on for what seems like forever is finally finished. It consists of 4 linked but distinct puzzle areas.

This map is designed to be challenging and for people who can think laterally. I've tried to make most of the puzzles portal oriented, not movement or jumping oriented.

Can you find the egg I've hidden and figure out what it explains?

Edit: New link:
http://forums.thinking.withportals.com/dload.php?action=file&file_id=156

Enjoy !

A couple of things about this map.

The flinging in the first area can be avoided by portal tunneling (or was that your intent?) The flinging is also very frustrating and difficult to get right.

If you die and load a saved game, the AI for the turrets shuts down and they don't shoot you.

Thanks for the quick reply.

In answer to your question about portal tunnelling it is a valid alternate way to solve the first puzzle. There are multiple intended ways of solving this and not everyone knows how to do this trick.

And with the AI failure I have never encountered this before and it sounds quite strange, can you tell me more about it?

I don't know anything about mapping, so I don't know what causes it or how to fix it, but from reading various Portal mapping threads, I gather that it's not all that uncommon of an issue.

The problem is that after dying on a map and reloading from a save (whether it's a manual or auto-save doesn't make a difference as far as I know) the AI on the sentry guns no longer works, so when you encounter them they just sit there and don't shoot at you, as though you weren't even there.

Overall I like this map. Some methods were a bit difficult, but I like how you gave alternatives in case one way was too tough.

For the first area, I managed to fling from point 1 to point 2, but trying to fling under that low ceiling to point 3 was too tough, until I released that you must just have to portal over close to it.

For the second area, when I first saw all those turrets, I wasn't sure it would be possible. I was just trying to portal behind each one and knock them out, which would only work for a couple, as the others were too well defended. I only discovered the boxes by accident, as I noticed another corridor leading under the turret area. I like how the areas the turrets were on were not portable, as it meant the player can't just pop up, attack then hide. They have to plan carefully to avoid being killed.

The third area, I believe you had to solve by getting the boxes from the previous area up to where you are, then stacking them up in the water so you can stand on them avoiding going into the water. That's a methos I've never seen or even thought of before. Well done on that bit. The turret afterwards was a bit of a surprise. It's good to have aspects of the unexpected dotted around a map.

The final area was a bit too much a game of trial and error though. I found that you could mostly avoid the ball if you just kept close to a wall and crouched all the way past it. Getting it into the ball catcher was just a case of gradually moving the portal the ball came out off bit by bit along the floor and ceiling, until it eventually connected.

Being able to see the end of the map at the very start was a nice touch however. BTW I didn't have any problems with the AI, so I guess it works for some and doesn't work for others.

The file you selected does not exist.


Hmm update link?

I'm glad you liked it Megadude. With the AI problem I don't think it's related directly to my map, possibly it's just an odd problem with Portal.

The link to the map download seems to have mysteriously disappeared along with several other maps. If it doesn't come back I'll re-upload it.

It seems the maps from the past few days have vanished. Must have been from fixing the download problem. Probably best to reupload just in case.

Edit: About the easter egg you've hidden, is it the pile of security cameras in one of the observation rooms. That's the only thing I could find

Yeah that's it. Now you mention it, it does seem a bit lame. The point of the security cameras in the observation room is that there are no cameras left on walls that are portalable, they have all been detached by an unknown test subject.

Re-uploading now.

To make that work, you would probably have to make it so the player can portal into the room. Since you can't get into the room, the previous person cannot have got in, so people will not think someone else has been tested.

But, this person has escaped from the testchambers like Chell did and was able to get into any of the observation rooms by just opening the door into them.

I didn't really enjoy this map; however, that's not to say that it's a bad map - it's just not the kind of map I like.

Construction wise, this map is built quite well with a consistent level of quality throughout and few unique visual details (some of the lighting, etc.). Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe there were cube maps - this detracted from the final polish.

The thing that really affected my level of enjoyment is quite simple: the map felt like it wanted to kill me. Make a single mistake and you are dead Even in the first puzzle, I was dying before I knew what exactly it was I was supposed to be doing. I eventually just tunneled through the opening area because once I figured out what I needed to do, I was tired of trying.

The turrets were easy enough (done without cubes 'cus I didn't know they were there) but the next little bit was also a bit aggravating to me because I didn't bother to think that you would break the Portal Convention of cubes being destroyed in toxic water.

Once I figured that out, the rest was easy enough, though you did try to kill me one last time with the energy pellet.

I just don't find being killed/dying all that enjoyable - it is far more annoying/frustrating than challenging.

All that said, I can see why some players would enjoy it - this one just wasn't for me.

Thanks for the comments.

In the readme file that comes with the map I describe how the cubemaps weren't showing properly and that you had to build them yourself in the console. I've placed all the env_cubemap entities and tried to build them when I went in-game but they only seem to work once and then they default back to non-reflective surfaces.

For the knowledgeable player it isn't too hard to build the cubemaps yourself.

About the map seeming to want to kill you, I found it as really the only way to increase the difficulty of the map because of me wanting to construct this map as a challenge. Making the player do portal tricks can only go so far.

As for the water I can see your point about the cubes being destroyed in it but in the professional levels I'm not sure that water does actually destroy cubes, the water is probably too deep to tell.

Here is a link to the thread that talks about getting your cube maps to work properly (I personally do what Remmiz posted).

http://forums.thinking.withportals.com/making-cubemaps-and-bonus-map-scripts-work-together-t517.html

As for the water, I suppose you could make a sign or something, or rework that very small section.

most of the puzzles can be bypassed with this jump:

http://it.youtube.com/watch?v=W2xmRErXyYE

Uh, when I spawn I spawn with no portal gun. Is that intentional?

Firstly let me say this map well constructed, and i did like the part with the turrets. However, if there's a problem with "cubemaps" people do not read readme's. that needs to be listed in the download section or something. or find a way to fix it. now. i don't even know what "cubemaps" are lol. and didn't seem to care cuz the map played fine.

*************
*AND SINCE I HATE SPOILER TAGS STOP READING HERE IF YOU DON"T WANT SPOILERS*
*************



but. i didn't really like this map. although some sections were fun/well thought. i do like the fact that you had a loop. allowing you to see the end from the very beginning (very valve) but as someone else posted it seemed like this map wanted you to fail, and feeling like you are destine to fail usually turns people off. now i don't mind a challenge, but in most cases the ONLY way to find out "WHAT" to do was to just jump blinding down a hole or into some acid and try to take a "360degree-snap-shot" look around before you died, hoping you saw where/what to do fast enough. even from the very first puzzle. i had to die in acid several times before i could find all the portable walls. or find out wether a "double-fling" or just a regular jump-through-portal was necessary, and then the turrets i was busting my ass disabling them, and just went kamakazi into the chamber (dieing) when i saw the cube hallway (i did not use the cubes to kill the turrets but it atleast gave me a safe place to shoot from; i like to use turrets to kill turrets (eg)) and lastly the cube-stack in water, i had the cubes with me since the very beginning (just felt like bringing them) but didn't think to stack them, i tried about a million different shoot-portal-while-falling attempts before i thought "fug it i'm gunna try to stack these boxes in here" and to my surprise it worked :-p
i'm really not trying to be negative to you, cuz you built this map well, it just (in general) people do not want to have to dive blindly (and then die) just to figure out what to do. atleast i don't. once i figured out where/how to jump this map was very playble.

Beer-Me wrote:
Uh, when I spawn I spawn with no portal gun. Is that intentional?

I should have mentioned that I too spawned with no portal gun the first time I played - but I got the gun when I reloaded.

infernet89 wrote:
most of the puzzles can be bypassed with this jump:

http://it.youtube.com/watch?v=W2xmRErXyYE

Genius.

rellikpd wrote:

---

*AND SINCE I HATE SPOILER TAGS STOP READING HERE IF YOU DON"T WANT SPOILERS*

---

Spoiler tags are awesome.

yeah they are pretty cool

but...
the problem is... that it just looks weird to me.
but also. (atleast to me) they would seem to do the opposite of what you wanted, cuz (again; atleast to me) if i see those black lines. i am usually quick to move over them, just to read wth is under there.. unless i REALLY don't want a spoiler. but then i stay the hell out of the forum anyway,,, until i beat the level

msleeper wrote:
Spoiler tags are awesome.

imo, they're too dark... doesnt fit with the colour scheme, jumps out too much

taco wrote:
The thing that really affected my level of enjoyment is quite simple: the map felt like it wanted to kill me.

I agree with this. In my personal opinion, maps are better when you can look around and take stock of what you have at your disposal, what your objectives are, and tinker around with how to pull off what you need to do in order to reach your goal. This map obscured the goal a lot of the time, and since failure typically meant isntant death, it detracted from the enjoyability.

taco wrote:
I didn't bother to think that you would break the Portal Convention of cubes being destroyed in toxic water.

I don't believe any conventions were broken here. In Portal, toxic water doesn't ever destroy cubes, they just sink to the bottom. In most cases though, you're only given 1 or 2 cubes at a time, and the toxic water is fairly deep, so stacking them is never a viable option. In this map though, once I saw that I had about a dozen cubes at my disposal, it didn't take long before I thought to make some platforms for myself to stand on in the water.

I think if there had been a cube already in the water, to show that it's shallow, and that you can put cubes down without losing them, it would have helped the player along a bit.

With the cubemaps I tried what Remmiz suggested and they still didn't seem to want to work. I'll hopefully fix this problem in the near future but it doesn't seem to detract from the gameplay of the map.

I see what you mean about the consequence in most cases being death. Since I built the map I knew the intended way to solve all the puzzles and I could just run through it not realising that someone who had not played the map before would die.
In my next map I'll use more buttons and doors than hazard water and turrets. But I consider my map different to others in that the consequence is death, not failure to solve a puzzle. If this is a good thing or a bad thing is a matter of opinon.

Edit: and well done to infernet on the awesome speedrun. The spawning with no portal gun is unintended and it only started to happen recently. I'll try to fix the problem. In the meantime you can use the console to give you the gun

taco wrote:
Here is a link to the thread that talks about getting your cube maps to work properly (I personally do what Remmiz posted).

http://forums.thinking.withportals.com/making-cubemaps-and-bonus-map-scripts-work-together-t517.html

As for the water, I suppose you could make a sign or something, or rework that very small section.

i liked how it was done in hetzchase_nailway... just put one cube in the water. the player will get the idea.

ok so i just tried your map. i just feel that whatever kind of flings you're supposed to do at the beginning should be proceeded with an introductory room that teaches users the technique you are introducing in a safe environment.

you will note that in portal, the original game, the developers went out of their way introducing a concept, such as the double fling, in a safe, quick to repeat the concept, environment.

if you were to make any changes to your map (besides glass at the exit door instead of an emancipation grid) i would add those introductory rooms.

i still don't really have any idea what kind of flinging you're expecting me to do in that first area at all, to be honest. and as for those pits, its easy to just get trapped in them. so i guess i don't see the point, and like other players, i just decided to tunnel past all that, shaking my head. i really felt like i was missing out on learning some new technique or other.

i liked the turret area. right after i got to that i wondered what would happen if i rebuilt the cube maps... i did this and well i had to restart the level all over. boo.

i'm like some others here. i don't know what was wrong with the cubemaps. i don't know what cubemaps are. and i don't know what rebuilding them did. actually i seem to remember it having to do with reflections or something.

Man i love this map! Really cool The turrets section is really cool

i dont know if the cubes were to eliminate the turrets. I only used them to get to the acid pool and place a portal (placing a turret there too was just mean ). I eliminated the turrets one by one before discovering the cubes xD

Nice map, but it sure feels like it wants to kill you. But to me it felt like challenge rather than annoyance.

Even if, I definitely portal tunnelled the first fling, which is easy to understand but too tough to execute.

Also, breaking the convention of "goo kills cube" is bad.
For doing "you can't go but cube can" liquid, you can create electrified water using water+bright blue lights+tesla arcs (thanks Hurricaaane for this) : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RUeq13xVKQU

Stangely, I thought immediatly to put cubes in the water, probably because I already eliminated all other solutions in my mind. But still, this is bad.

But my impression on this map is globally good.
The connection between the beginning and end with the catcher is always a nice touch.

First off, thank you Fusion, for making this map. It was a high quality, professional looking map, with new several new ideas brought out. Like other's have said, I liked the idea of seeing the exit from the begining then looping around the map in a "one way loop".

The map did have some problems though, in my opinion. I agree with what Hyakkidouran and taco said.
The objectives/exits weren't clear on most puzzles, and the puzzles were frustrating. The first puzzle killed me so much while trying to solve it that it became frustrating, so I just portal tunneled it, which made me feel like I cheated. I still don't understand the intended solution.
The puzzle with the turrets, as people said, it wasn't clear the boxes were even there until after few dozen frustrating deaths.
And the under water cube stacking puzzle was frustrating too, because I had to kill myself to even see the exit of the puzzle (which shouldn't be how it is.) I couldn't figure out how to do it with portals, so I went back and got cubes to stack in the water. I see now that was intentional, but at the time I felt it was again cheating the map just to get by the puzzle.
Also, the final puzzle was tediuous trial and error. Not puzzle solving and not much fun.

I know this post sounded really negative, and I'm sorry for that, but I do mean to be constructive. Looking forward to your next map, and thanks again!

edit: added spoiler tags

there have already been several maps that allow you to throw cubes into goo without killing them.

as i said, as long as you show it, its fine.

here's a typical example of cubes and goo.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=MtO85-gnSmA

iamafractal wrote:
there have already been several maps that allow you to throw cubes into goo without killing them.

It's not because a thing was done many times that it becomes good...

The goo isn't transparent, so you usually can't get your cube back if you misplaced it or forgot where it is, leading you to being struck.

And in goo, you never know if the abscence of Glados voice means "my cube can go in go" or "the scripting is messed up in this map"

To me, it is a design flaw.

In electrified water, seems you can make the floor under it portalable, allowing you to get your cubes back in case you mess up. And you can always see your cube is there and isn't destroyed.

Thanks for comments, criticisms, suggestions. I am incorporating these ideas into a new map that I am currently making.

I've fixed (hopefully) the cubemap and spawning without gun issue in a recent update of the map which can be found at the same page it was before.

With the cube-in-water issue I agree with iamafractal that it isn't necessarily true that cubes are completely lost once they hit the water. I think that the cube part tests the lateral thinking of the player. Also with how the puzzles aren't explained it leaves things more open to the player's style of solving puzzles instead of being shown the 'intended' way of how to solve them.

Anyway, I hope you are enjoying my map and I enjoyed making it!

Hey man, long time reader, first time poster.

Pretty good map, although I think that I agree with people about the 'instant death' thing. I had no troubles with any of the puzzles using quicksaving and quickloading, but it kinda sucked being killed every single time i stuffed up.

The first bit was good, only wish there was a way to escape the pits once you've trapped yourself in them.

The second turret puzzle was brilliant, one of the most effective turret puzzles ive seen in a while.

The third puzzle, with the toxic water...i didn't use the cubes at all. It's kinda hard to describe what i did, but i basically dropped an orange portal facing horizontally on the level of the toxic water. I then walked off the edge right above the orange portal, shooting the blue portal into the lower pit as i fell. I then landed through the orange portal and came out of the pit.

After about 30 tries to get that, i was kinda pissed of when the turret started shooting at me. Luckily though, i escaped with next to no health

Good map, but please make that toxic thing a bit more obvious

Great map, it seems nowadays that people are obsessed with flinging, but at last someone has done a map that takes brainpower and not just timing and angles. A great map, I particularly enjoyed the turret room, that was brill!
Thanks

phil