I shouldn't have played a map this large after the bad week I've had. I had to noclip right from the start to find the portal surface for the first laser catcher. It went downhill from there. I finally gave up on the funnel room and noclipped the laser cube up there. I kept getting bad bounces by the cube dropping from the fan that may have prevented me from finding the solution, since the cube never went in the same direction twice in a row. I used the same portals for the laser at the end as at the beginning, so I didn't need all three cubes to open the exit.

It's a beautifully detailed map, but once again the destroyed theme got in the way of the puzzles. My reaction to the distractions is detraction. The puzzles were difficult enough on their own, without adding in all the visual clutter. The lighting was good everywhere, even in the darker areas of the map.

Overall, this is an amazing map. The little things I don't like about it are matters of preference and opinion, not poor design or execution. 5/5 from me.

P.S. I packed your files into a .vpk to make installing simpler. You should have packed the custom content into the .bsp file.

KennKong wrote:
I used the same portals for the laser at the end as at the beginning, so I didn't need all three cubes to open the exit.

Of course! This allows you to skip the whole turret room and exchanging the cubes in the upper level of the main room. Nice find! Now if some ninja-type person could find a way to get to that upper bridge from the main room, this map would really be broken.

Motig, what an awesome first map. I can just imagine how much hard work it must have been to put together!
Any minor criticisms I had have mostly been mentioned already. It was sometimes confusing trying to work out what the buttons actually did. For example the cube button which enables the elevator button might have been clearer if there was a glass cover which slides back to allow access. It's not normal to simply disable the button.

By the way, I've noticed that particle systems (on your vents) don't restart when you load a saved game. I've fixed this in my maps with a logic_auto OnGameLoad or whatever it's called.

Anyway, a really impressive effort. Looking forward to more.

sicklebrick wrote:
I think I remember someone saying you can fix the stuck cube by putting a trigger_vphysics_motion around the area with a tiny ass gravity value. Should stop the physics going to sleep.

That mas me. You can fix it with a trigger_push with a speed of 1 either up or down and flagged to act on physics objects.

RogerL wrote:
KennKong wrote:

I used the same portals for the laser at the end as at the beginning, so I didn't need all three cubes to open the exit.

Of course! This allows you to skip the whole turret room and exchanging the cubes in the upper level of the main room. Nice find! Now if some ninja-type person could find a way to get to that upper bridge from the main room, this map would really be broken.

Imo it's impossible, to get to the upper bridge, but it's possible to get cube from there and throw it on a button. This throw is kinda hard, took me about 15 minutes to figure out how. After that solving rest of the map is rather easy. I'll make video, to show you how

EDIT
Here we go:
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That was brilliant! I can't believe you got it on the button in one throw...

Heh, beautiful throw!

I just replayed the map. I didn't even know there was another weighted cube available in the main room! Gee, it sure is a lot easier with two reflectocubes and two weighted cubes. I did it the first time with just one of each to open the exit, although I'm pretty sure I used both reflectocubes while getting it set up.

I got through the funnel room without noclipping this time (or anywhere else), and I did it playing with a controller. So this map definitely does not require any ninja skills. So while I still call this map's difficulty level hard, it's 90% hard on the brain, not on the fingers. I did need to use a few quick loads, because the cube falling from the fan still bounces off the edge of the portal sometimes. I've added this map to my favorites playlist.

Bravissimo, Motig! An absolutely outstanding first map.

RogerL wrote:
That was brilliant! I can't believe you got it on the button in one throw...

Video is edited It was 4th or 5th throw

Marvelous - best map since "The Hard Way" and this one beats that map.
So nice to feel like I have a chance it I stick with it long enough - unlike the recent Genius Maps which are solved only be a specific few.

I did - however - get stuck in the vertical funnel room. I was able to seesaw high by dropping from above, grabbed the weighted cube and threw it into the funnel near the top where there was no fizzler. That took a lot of thinking and felt like a big acheivement.
BUT then I could not get the reflector cube onto the light bridge - so watched one of the solution videos.
At first I thought - if throwing cubes up 20 feet into the air so that they will make it across the water and into the sucker tube - are not Ninja skills . . . then I don't know what is. I cannot make that throw.

**Addendum: ** since sicklebrick's comment below . . I tried to do something else. Then I realized I could drop the cube from above the hole in the ceiling while following it down myself, let then cube seesaw once while shooting a portal into the side wall. Then it made it across. Will watch his and Markiu's videos later - after I get through this monster map. Still gotta go kill the damn turrets, which oddly - I did not do first.

PCdoc wrote:
I must say - if throwing cubes up 20 feet into the air so that they will make it across the water and into the sucker tube - are not Ninja skills . . .

Lol, I think a mixture of mine and marKiu's solutions is more along the lines of the intended solution for that room... a damn sight easier anyway ^^

Hey guys sorry for not replying, I've been away the whole weekend.

@KennKong: Good to hear you had more fun on your second playthrough and that it's playable with a controller! Getting the end door to open with just 3 cubes definitely isn't intended, I'll probably make it so you can't stand on the edge of the door. I had actually thought of making sure the cube would go to the middle of the ventilator but I wasn't sure if it's needed. I can see is being really frustrating though. Thanks for playing and giving it a second chance!

@grayarea: Thanks for letting me know about the particles, I did see that happen at someone else but I didn't figure out what caused it! You're probably right about the button not being very obvious, next time I have a similar setup I'll try to make it more clear and I'll be looking into the elevator bug. Thanks for playing and glad you enjoyed it!

@jacu: You're right about it being impossible to get to the top bridge. I knew I should've fixed that little ledge at the end door! Removing the little ledge should make that pretty hard to do since you'd have to shoot your portals in flight. Nice find though!, thanks for the video!

@PCdoc: Thank you for the kind words, glad you're enjoying/enjoyed it! ||My intended solution to that part is dropping it from the ceiling into a portal that leads to the ventilator. You can then turn off the ventilator to simulate a big drop and let the cube fling to the other side of the water. But as people have shown there are multiple solutions to it.

About the turrets, my intended solution is not to kill them but simply make it so you have the door closed and a lightbridge up. I never thought of killing them when making the map. The only way you can get past the turrets right now is by killing 2 and running really fast or doing it the intended way. The intended way is putting a laser cube on the elevator, you can then aim it at the door catcher and close it while using your portals for a bridge!||

I'll be making a new version later today that should fix the latest issues posted. After that there shouldn't really be any left I think.

Motig, re: the three turrets. You can get by them without closing the door, even with the fizzler in the way. Just run about 1/3 the way in front of the door then backpedal it to safety, and wait for them to start to shut down, then run across. It uses the shut-down timer glitch, but it works. Just thought I'd let you know.

Also, in the fan/sucker/lightbridge/funnel room, I solved that without using the fan to hold it to the ceiling, I just kept going up to the walkway you come in by and dropping it from that. I then put a portal on that one surface next to where the blocks drop from, and it sent the box into another fling-panel and, I timed the light bridge to turn on under it, using the funnel with the other box.

Very fun map.

Heh, I'm scared to report bugs incase it puts you off making another one :p
I know how it feels to finish a project then have to fix bits here and there.

So I'd like to point out that I'm not picking holes in the map; it's one of my favourites now and I've just been playing the shit out of it - like a whole bunch of people! A few bits are knda ninja and ignoreable, and a few you're probably already aware of, but here they are anyhoo

VNsY0ZC6x98

Very complex puzzle in the map. I went through most of it, but just couldn't get the turret room, had to noclip back (burned two) sorry. Also, couldn't catch the cube at 3 upstairs....not fast enough I guess....Excellent map, thanks for creating....

quatrus wrote:
Very complex puzzle in the map. I went through most of it, but just couldn't get the turret room, had to noclip back (burned two) sorry. Also, couldn't catch the cube at 3 upstairs....not fast enough I guess....Excellent map, thanks for creating....

Thanks for playing and telling me where you got stuck, helps me avoid confusing puzzles for the next map!

||The intended solution to get past the turrets is to close the door by using the elevator and a laser cube. That way you can close the turret door and just use a lightbridge with a portal.

If by 3 you mean the room with the tractor beam, you don't have to catch anything. There's actually multiple ways to solve it as people have found out. My intended solution is that you fling the cube towards the windows with the far right catapult and then you quickly disable/enable the lightbridge with the floor button to make sure it doesn't fall down. Or maybe you were trying to do that?||

@madcat1030: I know about the turret and the ability to run past them, I don't really think there's anything I can do about that so I'll probably just leave it be. Sounds to me like your solution to the room with the tractor beam is pretty close to how I intended it to be! Glad you enjoyed it!

@sicklebrick: Haha, cheers for the video! I'm actually glad most of the "bugs" don't really break the map but still force the player to use certain elements. I'll have a look at which ones I'll fix! And hopefully then start some work on a new map!

I think I will upload a video myself of how I intended the map to be solved so people can look at that when they're stuck.

I'm going to have to dissent from the opinions of about everybody else and say that, for the most part, I did not enjoy this map. It looks nice and has a neat ambiance to it, but it just wasn't fun for me. I'll explain why.

http://i.imgur.com/HbiDc.jpg
I spent way too long here trying to figure out what to do. I was able to hop along the sides of the platforms on the left, but it didn't seem right. It wasn't until I watched a playthrough that I figured out the wall in the back was portalable.

The rest of this room was okay. The puzzle wasn't bad, but not that great either.

http://i.imgur.com/pm7Mh.jpg
In the room behind this window, having cube droppers above the goo seemed really odd. Standing on the buttons to grab the cubes is really awkward and doesn't really add much to the puzzle.

http://i.imgur.com/VRQNG.jpg
The models here aren't solid. I fell through them unexpectedly.

http://i.imgur.com/SRUy6.jpg
This puzzle is really, really cramped. Everything is so ridiculously close together it's hard to move and consequently hard to get a feel for your surroundings. However, using the rubble to aim the laser was a good idea and was the one part of this level that made me feel smart.

The "funnel puzzle" I simply do not understand. I spent a good 30-40 minutes trying random things to no avail, and I eventually gave up and noclipped onward.

This side of the window needs mustiness like the other side.
The portal isn't all on the wall.
Help, I've fallen and I can't get up!
Texture misalignment

I don't mean to try and hurt you by posting this, but rather help by giving you specific criticism on how to make your map (and future maps) better. It just feels like you tried a whole bunch of non-standard stuff, and I'm not sure if it panned out well. It's a good map, but doesn't appeal to me specifically.

Hey Idolon, thanks for the detailed post! I think your points are very valid and I was aware of some of them when I submitted this map.

I agree that the start of the map is a bit too unclear even though I didn't change this before release. It's something I probably won't repeat as looking around with nothing to even try is no fun at all.

I spent a while thinking about why the cube droppers are above goo. And the reason is simply that it's just a really old remnant from when I first started with the map. I've just never really thought about it again. I could've made the water below them solid and it wouldn't have changed anything.

About the cramped room: I'm glad I didn't release it with the old version of that room then! It used to have a walkway in it as well where you'd have to duck to get around, it was way worse!

About the texture problems, they are mostly results of me not knowing about the brush sizes and texturing when starting this map. I've been able to get rid of most of the quirks by doing some rebuilding and sneaky scaling but some parts would've been too much work and I just wanted to release the map and move on to other projects.

And I'm not offended at all! I appreciate that you played the map even though you did not like it and let me know your thoughts. I guess in general you could say that the map doesn't really hint at the player what he/she should be doing/looking at. Some players will like having to look around whilst others won't. Cheers for the pictures and I'll have a look at fixing them!

I started the beginning just like Idolon, jumping across the left edges of the platforms. I didn't spend any time looking for a different solution though, that seemed intended at the time. When I came to the turrets I just assumed time for more jumping skills.

Quote:
The only way you can get past the turrets right now is by killing 2 and running really fast or doing it the intended way.

I found it pretty easy to jump past them with some strafing =p

I used the same thing in Sicklebrick's video a few posts ago (at 1:50) to bring all of those laser cubes through to the main room, so then I had no need for the last cube that spawned.

Yeah I saw that video after the post, I guess I just suck at it! I've fixed some of the things in his video in the latest version that I'm compiling now.

I enjoyed this map. There are a couple of problems that others have already mentioned. One is the start. I thought I'd somehow missed the section of the puzzle that raises the bridge. The only other real problem I had was the fan. I tried to throw the cube up at the fan a few times with no success so I ended up shooting a blue portal on 2 and the orange on the floor in between the arrows. Then I tossed the cube through the portal to the right and onto the catapult which shot it back through into the funnel. I did the same thing with the reflector cube but to the left and timed it so the bridge caught it.